CIC NEWS
With the summer wedding season about to get underway, the government of Canada has revealed that processing times for the Outland Spousal/Common-Law Sponsorship Canadian immigration program have, in many cases, been significantly reduced.
Until the end of 2015, application processing times for this program were listed by visa office. Around the New Year, however, the way in which processing times were listed changed. Instead of being listed by visa office, a single figure (in months) was given. Now, processing times are listed by individual countries where the application is being made.
This modification allows couples in a relationship to make better decisions on which sponsorship program to apply to: Inland or Outland. Moreover, in many cases it may allow sponsored persons to obtain Canadian permanent residence sooner than was previously the case — a factor that will come as a great relief to many Canadian citizens, permanent residents, and their foreign spouses and common-law partners who wish to be reunited in Canada as quickly as possible.
The processing times for certain countries, including the time it takes to make the initial assessment of the sponsor, are now less than one year. These countries include France, Australia, Spain, Tunisia, Belgium, Algeria, Morocco, New Zealand, Peru, Brazil, Iran, Israel, Portugal, Poland, Taiwan, Trinidad & Tobago, Ukraine, and Switzerland. For many other countries, the processing time is around one year or slightly longer. A full list can be found at the end of this article.
In March of this year, the new Liberal government of Canada announced in its Immigration Levels Plan that it intends to increase the number of new permanent residents who arrive in Canada through the Family Class category, including spouses and common-law partners. This factor may have the effect of further reducing application processing times.
About Outland Spousal/Common-Law Sponsorship
An Outland application is generally pursued when the sponsored partner is living outside of Canada. However, Outland applicants can still be in Canada and apply through the Outland program, and may be permitted to travel in and out of Canada throughout the application process. However, in such an instance it is at the discretion of Canadian immigration authorities as to whether the sponsored person may re-enter Canada during the process; it is also at their discretion as to whether the application may continue to be processed if the sponsored person leaves Canada during the process.
Outland applications are processed through the visa office that serves the applicant’s country of origin, or where they have been lawfully admitted for at least one year.
It should be noted that, though the processing times are now published in a different way (by country), eligibility criteria for the program remains the same. In order to be a sponsor, an individual must:
- be 18 years of age or older;
- be a Canadian citizen, Registered Indian or permanent resident;
- be sponsoring a member of the family Class;
- live in Canada or provide evidence, if a Canadian citizen living outside of Canada, that he or she will live in Canada once the person he or she is sponsoring becomes a permanent resident;
- sign an agreement with his or her spouse or common-law partner confirming that each partner understands their obligations and responsibilities;
- sign an undertaking promising to provide for the spouse or common-law partner’s basic requirements and, if applicable, those of his or her dependent children; and
- prove that he or she has sufficient income to provide basic requirements for the spouse or common-law partner’s dependent children, if applicable.
The person being sponsored (and their family members, if applicable) must:
- complete and sign the appropriate forms;
- undergo a medical examination prior to submitting the application (results are valid for 12 months);
- pass criminal and security verifications;
- obtain a passport and, in some countries, an exit visa; and
- attend an interview at a Canadian visa office, if required.
The other option: Inland Sponsorship
The other potential option for Spousal/Common-Law Sponsorship is the Inland route. Inland sponsorship is when the couple is together in Canada and the foreign spouse/common-law partner has temporary status in Canada, either as a worker, student, or visitor. The downside to the Inland route is that applications typically take longer to process.
However, the person being sponsored may be eligible for a much-coveted open work permit while the sponsorship application is being processed. In December, 2014, the government of Canada launched a pilot program through which sponsored persons through the Inland route may be issued open work permits before the ‘approval in principle’ decision has been made on their application. This pilot program was extended in December, 2015, and remains in place today.
At the time of writing, according to Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada (IRCC, formerly CIC), total processing times for Inland Spousal/Common-Law Sponsorship is 26 months.
Both options now have advantages
“For individuals who have the option of choosing the Outland or Inland route, both options now present more advantages than previously. On the one hand, reduced Outland processing times means that couples may be reunited with permanent resident status sooner, allowing them to build their lives, careers, and families in Canada with more confidence that their long-term future here is secure. On the other hand, the open work permit pilot program through the Inland route has, by and large, been a great success,” says Attorney David Cohen.
“For most individuals and couples who realistically only have the Outland option, reduced processing times are a huge bonus. As we know from history, however, sponsorship processing times may fluctuate over the long term. Therefore, I would advise Canadian citizens and permanent residents, and their spouses and common-law partners, to prepare an application sooner rather than later. In doing so, they could be reunited in Canada, living and working here, well before the end of 2017 and, in many cases, much sooner than that.”
To find out if you and/or your spouse/common-law partner are eligible for sponsorship, please fill out a free online assessment today.
Outland Spousal/Common-Law Sponsorship Processing Times
Country |
Processing time (in months) |
Afghanistan |
36 |
Albania |
9 |
Algeria |
8 |
Angola |
17 |
Antigua and Barbuda |
17 |
Argentina |
17 |
Armenia |
17 |
Aruba |
17 |
Australia |
11 |
Austria |
17 |
Azerbaijan |
17 |
Bahamas |
17 |
Bahrain |
17 |
Bangladesh |
26 |
Barbados |
17 |
Belarus |
17 |
Belgium |
10 |
Belize |
17 |
Benin |
17 |
Bermuda |
17 |
Bolivia |
17 |
Bosnia and Herzegovina |
13 |
Botswana |
17 |
Brazil |
8 |
Brunei |
17 |
Bulgaria |
13 |
Burkina Faso |
17 |
Burma (Myanmar) |
17 |
Burundi |
17 |
Cambodia |
26 |
Cameroon |
14 |
Canada |
16 |
Cape Verde |
17 |
Cayman Islands |
17 |
Central African Republic |
17 |
Chad |
17 |
Chile |
17 |
China (People`s Republic of) |
14 |
Colombia |
15 |
Comoros Island |
17 |
Congo |
17 |
Costa Rica |
16 |
Côte d’Ivoire |
13 |
Croatia |
17 |
Cuba |
14 |
Cyprus |
17 |
Czech Republic |
17 |
Democratic Republic of the Congo |
25 |
Denmark |
17 |
Djibouti |
17 |
Dominica |
17 |
Dominican Republic |
15 |
Ecuador |
17 |
Egypt |
14 |
El Salvador |
15 |
Equatorial Guinea |
17 |
Eritrea |
17 |
Estonia |
17 |
Ethiopia |
20 |
Fiji |
14 |
Finland |
17 |
France |
10 |
Estonia |
17 |
Gabon |
17 |
Gambia |
17 |
Georgia |
17 |
Germany |
13 |
Ghana |
14 |
Greece |
12 |
Grenada |
17 |
Guatelama |
17 |
Guinea |
17 |
Guinea-Bissau |
17 |
Guyana |
14 |
Haiti |
21 |
Honduras |
17 |
Hong Kong SAR |
13 |
Hungary |
17 |
Iceland |
17 |
India |
20 |
Indonesia |
17 |
Iran |
10 |
Iraq |
23 |
Ireland |
13 |
Israel |
11 |
Italy |
12 |
Jamaica |
20 |
Japan |
12 |
Jordan |
23 |
Kazakhstan |
17 |
Kenya |
20 |
Kosovo |
17 |
Kuwait |
14 |
Kyrgyzstan |
17 |
Laos |
17 |
Latvia |
17 |
Lebanon |
15 |
Lesotho |
17 |
Liberia |
17 |
Libya |
17 |
Lithuania |
17 |
Luxembourg |
17 |
Macao SAR |
17 |
Madagascar |
17 |
Malaysia |
17 |
Maldives |
17 |
Mali |
17 |
Malta |
17 |
Martinique |
17 |
Mauritania |
17 |
Mauritius |
17 |
Mexico |
17 |
Moldova |
16 |
Mongolia |
17 |
Montenegro |
17 |
Morocco |
9 |
Mozambique |
17 |
Namibia |
17 |
Nepal |
14 |
Netherlands |
16 |
New Caledonia |
17 |
New Zealand |
11 |
Nicaragua |
17 |
Niger |
17 |
Nigeria |
14 |
Norway |
17 |
Oman |
17 |
Pakistan |
28 |
Palestinian Authority (Gaza) |
13 |
Palestinian Authority (West Bank) |
13 |
Panama |
17 |
Papua New Guinea |
17 |
Paraguay |
17 |
Peru |
9 |
Philippines |
13 |
Poland |
11 |
Portugal |
9 |
Puerto Rico |
17 |
Qatar |
13 |
Romania |
13 |
Russia |
13 |
Rwanda |
17 |
Saudi Arabia |
17 |
Senegal |
18 |
Serbia |
13 |
Seychelles |
17 |
Sierra Leone |
17 |
Singapore |
13 |
Slovakia |
17 |
Slovenia |
17 |
Somalia |
17 |
South Africa |
15 |
South Korea |
14 |
South Sudan |
17 |
Spain |
9 |
Sri Lanka |
13 |
St. Kitts and Nevis |
17 |
St. Lucia |
16 |
St. Vincent and the Grenadines |
41 |
Sudan |
17 |
Suriname |
17 |
Sweden |
18 |
Switzerland |
11 |
Syria |
12 |
Taiwan |
11 |
Tajikistan |
17 |
Tanzania |
17 |
Thailand |
29 |
Timor-Leste (Timor oriental) |
17 |
Togo |
17 |
Trinidad and Tobago |
11 |
Tunisia |
8 |
Turkey |
12 |
Turks and Caicos Islands |
17 |
Uganda |
26 |
Ukraine |
10 |
United Arab Emirates |
13 |
United Kingdom |
14 |
United States of America |
15 |
Uruguay |
17 |
Uzbekistan |
17 |
Venezuela |
17 |
Vietnam |
24 |
Yemen |
17 |
Zambia |
17 |
Zimbabwe |
17 |
There is currently not enough data to provide information on the following countries: Andorra, Anguilla, Bhutan, Bonaire, British Virgin Islands, Holy See, Kiribati, Liechtenstein, Macedonia, Malawi, Marshall Islands, Micronesia (Federated States of), Monaco, Nauru, North Korea, Samoa, San Marino, Sao Tome and Principe, Solomon Islands, Swaziland, Tahiti, Tonga, Turkmenistan, Tuvalu, US Virgin Islands, Vanuatu.
© 2016 CICNews All Rights Reserved
Khalid says
It is really hard for some one like me that I have to wait more then 33 months to reunite with my wife when I heard this news it was really hard for me becouz we wish to reunite until middle of 2017 but unfortunately it is not work I don’t what should I do becouz my wife is and bad satusion she lives in a denguerues country
Kanouté says
canada j’aime trop labas j’aimerais partir faire mes études labas mais j’ai pas de moyen
Einon says
Having this kind of news update…we can say too good to be true. However me and my wife waited for so long. Still until now we haven’t received any confirmation letter from the IRCC/CIC office. Hope the office will release a very favorable news for those waited families to be reunited. Thanks.
Malathy Mathew says
I am a nurse by profession who hails from India. I am married to a student in Canada. He is also an Indian. He has completed 2 years of post-secondary education in Canada and is currently on Post-study work. His current visa will expire on 30th March 2017. As my husband left for studies immediately after our marriage we do not have children. SomI want to join my husband immediately.
I had earlier applied for visa to join my spouse but was refused. I do not have much savings in India.
In the circumstance am I eligible for a work Permit to join my husband.
Malathy
obilor ndubuisi marshal says
I want to know if am qualify to cananda
Hassib788 says
I and my spouse were so hopeful for the new govt policies especially on spouse cases to reduce the long wait time and let us reunit with each others but when i saw the news which takes 36months from my country it made me so hopeless and its even more increased then the previous govt
We are human beings too this is not a good decision
Where is human right now?
Aziz says
what would be the case if my wife is from a different country of origin than mine?
will the processing time be based on my, the applicant, country of origin? or is it going to be based on the sponsored country of origin?
lienga says
i need to travel in canada
youzeu kamgang danielle evelyne says
Je suis camerounaise a la recherche du travail j aimerai que s il vous plait vous me trouvez quelque chose a faire j ai pas de diplôme mais je suis très douer de mes mains je peu aussi garder les vieux faire du babysitting femme de ménage cuisinière travailler meme dans les hôtel comme le Canada est un pays très accueillant j aimerai y vivre avec mes enfants de 14an et 6 an j attend votre reponse
Jason Williamson says
Just to clarify for some people, to my knowledge you have to be a Canadian Citizen or a Permanent Resident (for like 3-5 years, says on the cic website) before you are able to sponsor someone. These Processing times are for the applicant country, the person living in Canada is the sponsor, the applicant is the person living in the foreign country which is where these times apply.
Sam says
Hi Jason can I have your e-mail id or whatsapp number?
Manpreet says
My name is manpreet kaur gillI’m 8 month pregnant with twins..It’s very hard to me coz my husband in India.I already apply for him the permanent visa for last year 2015 July 10…may due due date 27 may I don’t have anyone to take care of me. .
Asha2015 says
Why the inland processing time is longer than the outland?
Inland should more faster the processing time cos were contributing
to the government and were not asking help from the govt.
Since i got my work permit i got my job right away..
George says
Please I am in Ukraine and my partner have submitted his forms,we have waited for 2months but haven’t gotten any news yet if he is eligible or not???
LabAfrica says
As someone going through a similar experience, these options are not so heart warming but all the-same i will explore a few options that i think can work for me.
Ahmadzai says
It’s totally against human rights for afghans that they must have to live 36months away from his her spouse
This is playing with someones future and life
Anonynous says
What about the Inland applicants?
I mean I understand that being far away from your spouse is really hard, but for many, within no time they get their PR. While an inland applicant who went to a Canadian school pay a lot of money, have been in Canada for more than 5 years, started working and helped out their partner and is also paying taxes and knows the language, has to wait 26 months! That is ridiculous and not only to HOPEFULLY get a work permit extension, not be able to travel, heck not been able to afford to get sick because you won’t have health insurance covered until the first stage is done, which is a year! In conclusion, for at least a whole year you are useless until you get your PR card. Love and being with your partner won’t pay the bills, one salary is not enough now-a-days!
Cathy says
Good day,
When I saw these news I’m so happy because my husband is loosing his patient for waiting for our PR, my husband is Canadian by Naturalization and born Canadian. Me and my daughter came from Philippines. Our application is 9 months now. It means more couple months we will reunite our family.
Thanks to the new Prime Minister of Canada
Angela says
After lots of reading and rsearch, I decided to sponsor my U.S. husband through the Inland application process. Knowing that it would likely take about 2 years to complete but with an open work permit, we would be able to get by with us both working during that time. We had already spent the first 3 years of our life in different countries and were eager to get things going.
We applied for PR Inland at the end of Oct 2015. He got his work permit – valid for 2 yrs – in mid April 2016. At the beginning of May 2016, I received an email approving me as his Sponsor. At the beginning June 2016 he was notified his PR application has been approved and he will be contacted by our immigration office for his interview to finalize. The next week we got the date which is the end of June 2016. That’s 8 months from start to finish! A far cry from the wait times listed on CIC website and we are so happy that this process is almost at and end. We have our first baby due in July and he will be a PR by then!
amy says
i have bc pnp approval but cic refused my visitor extension and then restoration status + work permit also denied.
i am married here since Jan 2016.
what can i do now?
can i go for spousal sponsorship or back to India.
Please help me asap.
Thank you
giga says
Hello, I have filled out a visa to Canada, and I wonder if I have a chance. I would very much like to work in Canada
Shivinderjit Brar says
Hi I’m shivinderjit brar,I’m permanent resident in Canada. I made an application to sponsor my husband in 1stjune2016. How much time will take to process this application.
Thanks
Angelica Edades says
Hi! I am from manila philippines and i just got married to a Canadian last May 24, 2016. We are filing the outland sponsorship but still needing some clarification. My passport still has my fathers surname and also i have a new signature since i just got married. We are filing it as soon as possible, do i have to change surname in my passport and use my new signature? And also, i am currently in my 3rd year college, what of we got approved by next year but im still trying to finish school and still planning to go to canada and come in philippines until i graduate. Will that stay be counted in my permanent residency?? thank you!
Lindsay says
My husband and I have been married for 3 years and we have 2. Our wait time says 20 months… this is extremely heartbreaking and much too long for a family to be apart. I have already been approved to sponsor my husband and our medical was already requested and sent in. We are receiving such conflicting information as too how long this will take (6 months – 20 months) Our oldest child needs to start school this year so we are trying decide if she should attend school in Jamaica so we can all ne together or wait here in Canada and be apart.. If we had a more accurate time frame it would be easier to decide. I have also heard from many that once CIC requests for the medical exam you can expect a decision not long after…? Please if anyone can provide sone helpful information.
AL says
What is the processing time for an open work permit? We applied for an inland sponsorship. Thank you.
Salma says
It is very unfair for Afghan families to have to wait so long to be reunited. It is not safe in afghanistan at all right now. The partner living in canada constantly has to be worried about their spouse’s life while waiting for this process
brenda aure says
its a great pleasure to know more about common law partner
Bonnie says
I sent a letter to Mr. John McCallum, Minister of Immigration, Refugees, and Citizenship last week to complain about the unfair advantages being granted to new applicants for Spousal sponsorship. The new policy put in place to supposedly reduce wait times and backlogs by processing newly submitted files faster, has only served to make some of us with files already in process wait longer, and be considered less of a priority!! There is nothing but a complete tipping of the scales to unfair and unbalanced, unjust and undeserved mistreatment and mishandling of applications submitted prior to the new policy.
Here is my letter:
October 28, 2016
Dear Mr. McCallum,
I am writing to you, imploring you to investigate and look into how the proposed changes for the Government to address spousal backlog and wait times, as per the Notice posted from Ottawa on June 13, 2016 is a disservice to many of us.
Your proposed plan has failed many of us whom already had our applications for our spouses submitted. It has only served to not add any additional applications to a backlog, which is seemingly becoming its own specialized group of ‘set aside and forgotten about ‘. For any of us allotted to this group of ‘you can simply wait your turn until we bother to get back to you’ while we quickly process and finalize the so-called, complete and straightforward spousal sponsorship applications’ faster, it is an added stress and hardship that is unbearable. We all have to submit the same required documents and proof of our relationships, and our files are complete and up to date as well, so why the difference?
The Canadian Embassy in Havana, Cuba is small and with limited agents, especially considering that there is reported to be only one Canadian there that has the final say and approval. It would seem that this Canadian is being completely occupied by the processing of the newer files. There are limited spousal visas for Permanent Residents, and limited time slots available for the issue of these visas, so where does that leave those of us waiting for our turn, and hoping to be processed fairly? Relegated to wait for an undisclosed or guessable amount of time, without due consideration, or the same rights or entitlements as those whom were simply fortunate enough to have submitted their applications in 2016, and falling under the umbrella of the new policy?
Apparently they have also added a new glitch to the process in Havana by having only one Canadian Agent for final approvals or decisions. Now, even if an interview has been attended by an Applicant, once again you must wait for the Canadian Agent to be available to review your file. There are no set time lines or posted times for how long you must wait. We are expected to wait until their office contacts us. The time range for this part of the process can be days, weeks, or months. However once again, it would seem that those with newer files from 2016, jump the queue ahead of others for yet another unjustified preferential consideration.
We personally have now waited an additional 60 days after my husband’s interview, with no idea how long it will be before we our notified of the decision for our application. We have only been told that it has been sent to the officer in charge of our file for final review. The office in Havana has had some couples waiting for 8 months, or possibly more after the interview without any further notice as to when a decision will be granted. Inhumane treatment and inflicting prolonged stress and duress to all relegated to this position.
The officers at the Embassy in Havana have been given free license to process the new files from 2016, giving them precedence. As per the new policy:
For Applicants:
“If you have not yet submitted an application to sponsor your spouse or partner but plan to do so, the application will not be dealt with as part of our backlog reduction efforts, but it will be processed as quickly as possible.”
“IRCC’s work to reduce the backlog will eventually benefit all spousal applicants—whether they are already in the backlog or submitting a new application—by bringing down wait times for all.”
– When will ‘eventually benefit all spousal applicants’ actually become a certainty for all?
“Ottawa, June 13, 2016 – As part of its commitment to family reunification, the Government of Canada will grant permanent residence to more spouses, partners and dependent children of Canadian citizens and permanent residents this year. This will significantly reduce the backlog of existing applications and speed up processing times going forward.”
-How will this reduce the backlog if they continue to process the new files faster, but leave the older files sitting in limbo?
“Each year, the Government sets how many permanent residents Canada intends to admit through its various immigration categories during the year. This is done with the annual immigration levels plan. The plan for 2016 reflects the Government’s key priorities for immigration, which include bringing more families together.”
“This year, the Government increased the number of spaces allowed for spouses, partners and dependent children by 14 000, bringing it up to 62 000 spaces.”
“Over the past few years, more people have applied to come to Canada in the spousal category than there was space for in previous immigration levels plans; this has created a backlog. This year, the Government will reduce this backlog.”
“Tackling the spousal backlog will ease the uncertainty faced by spouses and partners wanting to move forward and build their lives in Canada with their family and help them integrate into our communities and our economy.”
-The uncertainty has only been vastly increased for those waiting for their file to be processed because the newer files have been given precedence, and the only reason that they warrant preferential treatment is because the government has sanctioned this new policy as procedure.
“Increasing the number of admission spaces for spouses and partners is one of the measures the Government has taken to support family reunification. Through Budget 2016, $25 million was also allocated to support faster and more predictable processing times for family sponsorship.”
– They have removed any predictable processing times for anyone outside of the new policy and its special handling and considerations for newer applicants.
Once again I implore you to follow up on these dire concerns of unfair treatment and undeserved suffering administered to all and any of us that have been deemed a part of your ‘Spousal backlog and wait times’. We are Canadians and humans too! We deserve and demand the same rights, considerations, and due processing of our applications to be reunited with our loved ones. We deserve our turn just as much as any of the people, whom simply had the good fortune to submit their file in this year, 2016 and benefited greatly by being given a leap to the front of the line. I can only view this as a complete failure as an implemented change to alleviate the backlog at the Canadian Embassy in Havana, Cuba, and as an inexcusable disservice to any of us who have been by-passed, overlooked and pushed aside for the newly sanctioned and deplorable procedure of processing the newer files first.
Amenda Walton says
i feel your pain. I was married in June 2014. The out land application was received in Mississauga in January 2015. I was approved as my husbands sponsor in March 2015. His application reached Abu Dhabi office in April 2015. With the completed form he also had submitted his police reports and medical reports.
January 2016 he was called for his interview in Riyadh where he lives
His previous medical and police reports had expired since it had been one year old so my husband had to re issue his medical and police checks, they were received in April 2016 to their office in Abu Dhabi
They asked for his right to permanent residency fee which was submitted immediately, that was in May 2016.
the original time for Abu Dhabi office was 13 months processing including sponsors application time
In December 2015 it changed from 13 months to 18 months when the system changed to country into of office
In August 2016 I used the online form to ask for an update since 18 months had pasted
They sent me a letter saying his application was undergoing the standard background check
One week later they sent a request to my husband … Again … for his right to permanent residency fee which he re sent to them his receipt that it was already paid in May
October 2016 I sent again another request asking for an update since it has been one year since we’ve seen each other since he was refused a visit visa to Canada as they feel he wouldn’t return to KSA although he has plenty of documents showing his status there, his job of 4 years with the same corporation and his family ties
I have flown to KSA 3 times in 2 years to be with my husband including marrying him there because they wouldn’t allow him to visit here for our marriage
I could not fly to KSA this past year because the jet lag was so bad on me last year I got behind on my studies and took me so long to recoup
If this is true and they are pushing through new applicants faster then the one’s already in the system this if completely unfair and unjust
Family reunification is very important for everyone because it is very difficult to get your life together and move forward when you don’t know from one day to the next when your spouse will join you so you can settle and make plans for work, school and family.
All I can say is patience is a virtue and patience is the only thing in this process I have control over.
Good luck to all and hope we all are united with our loved ones soon. God bless
Sam says
Dear Amanda
Are you in PR status now? If yes, did you applied spouse visa after getting your PR status? Kindly reply.
Amenda Walton says
Unfortunately we are still waiting for his PR visa
we are hoping we will hear very soon from Immigration to issue is PR visa
According to a Toronto Immigration lawyers office my husband phoned his application is finished, now we must wait for his visa
Ananthu says
If i do the process via outkand program, am i eligible to work in canada soon?
Sam says
Hi
My wife (Indian) is in Canada since Feb – 2015 and she’s a PR(Permanent Resident). Myself and my Daughter living in India. Now she is planning to take us there. We might apply for spouse and children dependent visa by feb – 2017. I would like to know the time duration for us to get the visa. We are going to apply from India through a consultant. If anybody knows the duration, kindly reply. Thanks in advance. Good day..
Dorothy says
Hello, just a question.. My husband sponsorship process is now in Havana, can he still apply for visitors visa to come see me and his daughter or better not? Thank you